News
TV confidential Interview
Blind Abilities – Creating Audio Description
Jeff Thompson:
Creating Audio Description (AD) is an interesting area of work. To be placing information into gaps and moments not necessarily intended for AD yet the art of placement and conciseness is quite the skill.
What got your interests in AD?
Audio Describer:
I have my bachelor’s degree in literature and have been writing creatively for over a decade. I am also a huge TV and film addict. I have always loved how films and TV find unique ways of telling a story. When writing my own creative work, I enjoy writing the description more than anything else. The last year I was in college, I was looking for a job and found an opening with my company for a Captioner position. I sent in my resume and was surprised when my boss contacted me for an interview as an Audio Describer instead. Part of the interview process is a test where we are given clips from 4 different types of shows, and we have 90 minutes to describe each one. My boss told me not to worry if I don’t finish all of them, no one does. He was shocked when I not only finished them, but also had gone back and edited my work a couple times. I was hired a week later. I didn’t even know about Audio Description before that. During the 5 years I’ve been with my company, I’ve become very passionate about accessibility and I love my job. It’s uniquely suited to my skill set and personality.
Jeff Thompson:
I edit audio all the time and I find myself listening for edits or inserts and the mechanics, do you find yourself watching a random movie and thinking about AD?
Audio Describer:
I eat, drink, breathe, and dream about AD. When I’m home, I turn on the TV while I’m cooking, cleaning, etc. And I know that any time I have to look at the screen to understand what’s happening in the program, that’s when I would put AD. When I go to the movies, I look at all the posters to see what studio is releasing it. If it’s a studio we work with, I go home and look up the trailers, so I can strategize how to handle the description for it. I also often think to myself when watching a movie that would be challenging to describe, “Oh, I’m so glad I didn’t have to work on this.” LOL.
Jeff Thompson:
Do you get feedback from a Blind/Visually Impaired (BVI) person(s)?
Audio Describer:
Unfortunately, we don’t get much feedback from the community. Mostly we get feedback from the clients. I find this frustrating because the BVI community is who I’m writing for, not the clients.
Jeff Thompson:
Does the person that does the voice ever give you feedback?
Audio Describer:
We do get some feedback from the voice artists. We take their opinions into consideration, and will sometimes make changes based on them. There are a lot of things to consider on our end though, so we can’t make changes based on their feedback too often. I have to think about the fact that some narrators have trouble saying some things, no matter how much we work with them. We also try to keep some things vague for a reason, usually locations that not everyone would know because not all viewers are from that area. We also have to stick to what the client wants. And during broadcast season, we have a tight mix schedule and can’t waste a lot of time making changes in the mix room.
Jeff Thompson:
Do you write with a tone for each movie or is your descriptions pure narrative and neutral?
Audio Describer:
I wrote for the tone of the film/show/episode. Kids shows, the AD is more simply worded, more youthful and bubbly. Horror movies, the AD is darker and more grotesque. Period pieces and dramas, the AD is more prosaic and emotional. Action movies, the AD is more exciting and punchy.
Jeff Thompson:
How do you see the future in AD, I know it is getting more availability, from your perspective, is AD getting more awareness from the industry?
Audio Describer:
The industry is a lot more aware. We are getting so much more work, especially streaming work. The movie studios could do a better job providing more content, but some of them are providing a lot more than when I first got hired. I’m hoping this uptick is a step in the right direction. We are providing AD for commercials now, 4D theme park experiences, and trailers.
Jeff Thompson:
As a BVI person, I love the seamlessness of watching an AD movie that has just enough AD. Not too much as sometimes an awkward silence says a lot. How tough is it to find that balance?
Audio Describer:
We have several unwritten rules/questions we ask ourselves: Is the visual more important than the dialogue here, thus warranting talk over? How much information does the dialogue give us about what is happening visually? Does the weight of the dialogue warrant no description or a pregnant pause before description starts? Do I think the scene is confusing without clarification through description? I also try to work around sound effects, music changes, and extradiagetic lyrics that I feel convey the emotion of the scene or a character’s feelings and thoughts.
Unfortunately, I don’t always get a say in the final result because we have some clients who want wall to wall description, regardless what we try to tell them.
Jeff Thompson:
Describe your process from start to finish when taking on a new movie/project.
Audio Describer:
For TV shows that I’ve been working on for years, I no longer watch the episode before describing it because I know it well enough to know what to expect. It’s faster that way, and I can also go back and change my description if I get to the end and find I need to fix something. Like if we find out a character isn’t who they said they were in the beginning.
For non-new release movies that will air on TV or a streaming service, I only watch it first if I’ve never seen it. Honestly though, that’s rare when it comes to me. I watch everything.
For new release films, I watch the trailer for the film to get an idea what to expect. I then watch the movie first and makes notes on anything I find that needs to be conveyed in description. I think about how I would describe someone’s appearance, what acting decisions are being made, along with what directorial, narrative, sound design, and cinematic decisions were made.
I then tell my boss which narrators I think would fit the project, but this doesn’t always go my way. Sometimes, I’m out voted by my bosses or the client, or the narrators I want are not available.
We describe films reel by reel, and generally have around 3 people working on the same film, so communication between us is key in order to keep things consistent. We have a database where we can share details and notes as we all work on a project. I then watch the film again as I describe, mapping out places where AD should be and writing what the narrator will read.
Once the description is finished for the film, the script goes to an editor/Post Production Supervisor (PPS). That’s my job title, PPS. Only one PPS works on a film. Our job is to watch the film and make notes, then watch the film again as we edit description. For the editing process, my job is to check for accuracy and consistency, research what something is if I question it, rewrite sentences if they are clunky, too hard to say, or awkward, time out the description for the narrator so the description happens as the action is happening when we can, add description if we feel the visual needs clarification, cut description if we feel it’s unnecessary.
After I have finished editing the script, I print out three copies, one for me, one for the narrator, and one for the audio engineer. We then schedule a mix and book the narrator.
On the day of the mix, I hand the narrator their script, and the audio engineer gets them set up in the sound booth. The audio engineer and I then go into a separate room where the mix board, TVs, and computers are. I communicate with the narrators through an intercom system. They hear my voice through their headphones, and we hear everything they say into the microphone. And I mean we hear everything, page turns, mouth noise, chair squeaks, clothes rustling, them shifting, belching, throat clears, stomach noises, etc. The mic picks it all up, and it’s my job and the audio engineer’s job to keep track of it.
We record reel by reel as the film plays for us and the narrator. I mark my script wherever I want retakes, to check a visual, or to change description. At the same time, the audio engineer also places markers in the ProTools session where he needs to do clean ups, feels a retake is needed, questions the description based upon the visual, or where he needs to go back and change the volume levels on AD based upon the volume of the program audio.
After the recording and all the retakes, we let the narrator go, and the audio engineer and I move description around to put things to picture, get off dialogue, or get off sound effects. The audio engineer then does his cleanups and volume alterations while I attend to other projects.
When he finishes, we then watch the film again, going cue to cue to double check description with the AD track and mark any places where we might need to bring the narrator back for fixes. A QC person then watches the film with AD and makes notes where they feel we might need to bring the narrator back. If we need to bring a narrator back, I then make changes in the script and print 3 copies of the pages we need and record those changes with a narrator.
The AD is then sent to another post house where the Digital Cinema Package (DCP) is wrapped. The film is then screened by the client. If everything goes well, we deliver the final files to the client. If something needs to be fixed our company has to pay $1200 to rewrap the DCP, as well as incur any cost for bringing narrators back.
Jeff Thompson:
Knowing that your work is intended for the BVI community, and that the community is a small percentage of the viewers of movies, it makes me believe that the feedback is hard to come by and the rewards are the fact that you are doing something for people who need AD is your solace or resolve.(?)
Audio Describer:
That’s exactly correct. I always wanted a career where I felt that I was helping people. I love that I am able to provide a service that enriches the community member’s lives.
Jeff Thompson:
How can people get feedback to you or to an AD team?
Audio Describer:
Have the community members contact the companies that provide AD directly. Try to contact the studios directly if you can. Be loud in the media about more accessibility. The negative press that Netflix got over not having AD when they launched Daredevil lit a fire under the butts of a lot of studios.
Now, I have a few questions for you…
What do you consider to be good description versus bad description? For instance, what shows do you feel have good description?
I easily recognize characters voices without having to see their face or being told who is speaking? Do you find that the BVI community also feels this way?
We try to avoid talking about race if it is not plot relevant. Do you feel that this is a mistake?
Does the community wish that AD were available in multiple languages?
Does the community wish that AD were more akin to literary writing? Or are you happy for it to not be like that?
If a film is primarily about a man’s experience, would you rather the narrator be Male? Same question for a movie primarily about a woman’s experience?
Are there any shows in which you would like a different narrator on?
Does it bother you when a show that usually has one narrator has an episode in which another narrator is used?
For films like 50 Shades of Grey, do you feel the description should not hold back based on the content of the story?
Does the amount of staring in description bother you?
Do you feel that using a larger vocabulary in description is good/bad?
We would love to hear your responses to these questions. Submit your response to us by email.
Contact:
Thank you for listening!
You can follow us on Twitter @BlindAbilities
On the web at www.BlindAbilities.com
Send us an email
Get the Free Blind Abilities App on the App Storeand Google Play Store.
Check out the Blind Abilities Community on Facebook, the Blind Abilities Page, the Job Insights Support Groupand the Assistive Technology Community for the Blind and Visually Impaired.
Interview at Deborah Kobylt Live
In Depth MEAWW interview
Roy Samuelson is a huge celebrity, and you may not very well recognize his face. But, there is no way you don’t recognize his voice. This voice-over actor has compelled us to buy amazing products, held our attention while watching movies and TV shows and now keeps us alert while driving and engaging in other mundane activities.
From ‘Spider-Man: Homecoming’ to ‘Baby Driver’ his voice-over credits speak for his talents. Samuelson tells Meaww some of the tricks of his trade and gives us a glimpse into the incredible journey of a voice-over artist.
You have one of the most recognizable voices in America. What do you look for in a project before taking it on? How do you make it uniquely yours?
I am lucky to have projects in different aspects of voice over — regardless of the voice over project, my focus is on telling a story, mainly through narration or promos. I mostly love using my voice to blend into a movie or series with descriptive narration. With all the different kinds of projects out there, it can feel like a juggle as to what to focus on! I find that when there’s easy movement with little resistance for a project, that’s the best focus for me. I like to find the least friction, and it’s amazing how that changes from one kind of work to another. Lately, I’ve found one particular kind of narration to be my most passionate with the least resistance.
To make the project mine, I’ve found that blending into the story is usually the best choice. I can be a shy person, so I’m not actively seeking the spotlight! But this idea of blending in is more about allowing the spotlight to be on the story, and whatever I can do to make sure that spotlight stays on the story. So, ironically, for me to own the projects I work on, I give it away, right back to serve the story.
From ads to video games to TV shows, you have provided your voice for them all. How is working on each of these different?
To best answer your question, I’ll first start with sharing a common thread in voice-over work: acting. If I’m voicing a gangster hijacking a vehicle, playing a Turtle with karate skills and a fondness for pizza, playing a dad just trying to sneak in a nap, simply “playing myself” as I tell a story about a TV show that you’d be interested in watching, or describe what’s happening in a story, each of these are characters, with motivations, intentions, and reasons for sharing what they are talking about. So based on answers to those questions on motivation, character, and intentions, I adjust the performance to best answer these questions. I find that practice and imagination are the two magic ingredients.
What has been your favorite project so far and why?
On one project the job started with me being handed over a hundred pages of narration, paragraph after paragraph, with audio, visual, and timecode cues. Most cues had to fit within a certain amount of time. We finished in under 4 hours. I found myself getting in the flow of each element working together, and there is an excitement and a sense of life that comes from doing something ice cold like that!
Are there any common mishaps in your line of work that people don’t expect? How do you deal with/overcome them?
One common mishap that is easy to slip into is the assumptions, based on false expectations. One aspect of assuming: it’s easy to think “OH YAY I BOOKED IT THIS IS GONNA LAST FOREVER!” or “Darn, I didn’t book that job I was so right for so, therefore, my career is over.” These are both false perspectives, based on all-or-nothing thinking. It’s easy to slip into this because each job can be unique, and uncharged, and unfamiliar, that its newness makes it seem solid, real, and permanent. I still have yet to find a perfect and detailed guidebook where each step you follow leads you to “career success” – that manual doesn’t exist! I find that by reminding myself of the bigger picture, the long-term perspective has been incredibly helpful in weathering the ups and downs of a career.
Another false assumption is coming into a job with a sense of fixed talent (thinking I know exactly what the job requires), instead of openness to growth. Even with repeat jobs, there are unexpected happenings, unusual surprises, both good and bad!, and changes out of the blue. Being flexible and having a “go with it” attitude helps tremendously for everyone involved, including the voice inside your head.
Bottom line: if I catch myself assuming something, that’s a good time to either speak up and ask about it, or step back and re-evaluate what I’m looking at in a different way. I think this kinda works in real life too.
I understand that Descriptive Narration is your current focus. How is it different from everything else you have done? What is your goal for voice-over work, specifically in this genre?
Descriptive Narration is a special audio track that goes on top of a movie or TV show. In it, I describe the action that sighted people see on screen for audiences who are blind or visually impaired. I treasure the times I’m lucky enough to be brought in to do this work! This job is a combination of a lot of my other experiences in voiceover, all rolled into one! It is cold reading, narration, and staying in the flow, along with a lot of timing and technical adjustments. Descriptive narration jobs usually give me the script a few minutes before we start rolling.
Aside from knowing the genre (by watching a trailer of a feature, or knowing a sense of the flavor of a tv show), I dive in, mostly not knowing what’s going to happen, and make guesses as to what’s about to happen, and adjust to things that are happening. It’s easy to fall through the cracks with a blubbering word mispronunciation; and when that happens, it can be hard to get back up into the flow. I’ve practiced failing in many ways during my voice over experiences. Each failure has given me new (and hopefully better!) ways to respond to similar circumstances in the future! My goal is to continue to grow my skills and double the current opportunities for TV shows and features, by expanding the exposure of this kind of narration to newer audiences, like commuters
This specific form of a voice-over, as I understand, was initially used to help visually impaired fans, but it is now being commercialized. What are your thoughts on that? How appreciative are you of the fact that people can now listen to the description of TV shows like they would an audiobook?
I think this expansion to greater audiences is really exciting! You are right with the similarity to podcasts and audiobooks — both of which are growing in popularity (I live in Los Angeles, so I assume it’s because people are commuting for sometimes a dozen hours a week!). Some audiobooks link up to digital reading devices, where the audiobook picks right up where you stopped reading. I imagine TV shows and features can also benefit from this audio description service — for drivers. It’s obviously unsafe to drive and watch — but to make it easy to drive and hear, right where you left off? How great is that! And with all the original produced audio included! It sounds like such a great opportunity for everyone who uses this service. And it already now exists on many streaming services! It’s just kinda buried. I’d love to see a “drive” feature for these streaming services. And the best part is the more people demand it, the more opportunities for the blind and visually impaired to have even more selection of media! Again, everyone wins.
Have you ever wanted to try/have tried voice-over work in other languages? If you haven’t, what language would you like to debut with?
I voiced on a TV pilot that had its own language. I loved exploring how to enunciate the words and phrases, then how to say it in a way that sounded real, and not like I was reciting. (My brother lives in Japan; the first time I visited him, I was enthralled with the language and experience of navigating in a world where I couldn’t read, speak, or understand most symbols. I felt like a 4-year-old discovering reading, and in the best way possible! The new language learning felt like that.) It exercised some unique learning synapses!
Have you had moments where people do not recognize you in person but are able to place you as soon as you speak? Could you tell us your funniest fan encounter?
I remember one time I was going through a particularly bleak time in my life and career. I had recorded several hundred promo spots from home, and my only exposure to it was sending that audio file out — into what felt like the ether. I was questioning a lot of my efforts, wondering if anything was happening and if it was time for me to give up and throw in the towel. I had an audition at a new studio, and came in, wrote down my name, and sat down. The director came out and called my name, asking if I had seen the copy. When I answered, she lit up: “I hear you in my car every day!” At that point in my life, I felt like I was hiding under a log, in a distant forest, but yet, without knowing it, I had been a part of her commute. When I find myself questioning the seemingly useless efforts, I like to remember this story — not that “I was heard” — but that sometimes, I may not know where things may lead.
A funny fan encounter was when a friend of mine and I randomly stopped at a restaurant in the middle of central California one weeknight. A patron seated at a table next to us came up to both of us — within minutes, she named a movie he starred in and pointed out that I sounded “like that guy in that commercial” – and sure enough she was right for both of us. I hope she’s in casting now because she sure has the memory recall and the ears!
What are some of your most exciting upcoming projects?
In addition to some upcoming commercial work, this fall I’m coming back to some series I narrate. It’s a great team, and even though I only come in a few times a week for a few hours, there’s a genuine joy to see the smiling faces and collaborate together. I deeply appreciate that collaboration: most of my work is in isolation in a booth, where I read a script and send an audio file and get feedback in an email. Having the person to person interaction brings a life and an immediacy to the work. I love all voice-over, and I’m excited my representation brings me varied opportunities, so that I don’t need to be pigeon-holed into only one kind of voice over.
What are some of the items on your career bucket list?
In addition to doubling the series and features for Descriptive Narration, I’m looking to get to the point where I not only work as often as possible but also still have time for rest and some ease. I do love the hustle of my work, either in a studio booth on a job, or auditioning, or better getting to know people in different aspects of the business (that alone always expands my perspective out of my own isolated experiences!). But I’ve not had the feeling of being bored in a while, or a day or so where I had no commitments or obligations. So if I’m doing all the work I love, and still having moments of quiet, that sounds like a welcomed novelty, just for a few days. Hmmm. Maybe I can sneak in a nap right now…
